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Training Routines....are we even close to getting it right

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Training Routines....are we even close to getting it right

Postby samurai69 » Tue Oct 18, 2011 6:25 am

Routines

8x8
5x5
3x8
Pyramid up
Pyramid down
pre exhaust
train to failure
westside
5/6 day split
upper lower
push pull
321
etc etc etc

all have a planed style of training, mand i agree they do work for some muscle groups.

Over the last few months in my own gym i get people to start with 3x8 then move on to 5x5 full body workouts....these t2 routines IMO give a gopod BASE to start from, the 3x8 with dumbells is a good foundation and the 5x5 is the first or second course of bricks

as we get more experianced and start to understand more about intensity we need to change things around (to keep growing) and as we do that other body parts catch up and some settle and some start to slip a bit.

The reason for this is IMO......is that each body part needs a different routine all of its own and each person has a different need to do that

example: my lats get a pump just thinking about training, but respond to heavy high rep dumbell rows (particularly but any row works) better thanmost other exercises and i can hit them 2 times per week, my shoulders on the other hand need a week to recover and respond best to a heavy weight routine followed by 2 or 3 isolation ex3ercises, my lower back works best with heavy heavy deadlifts for lots of single reps and needs a week and a half before its ready, legs really reavy and need 2 or 3 weeks to recover, biceps 3x6-8 quite heavy every 3 days, triceps best with 3 or 4 exercises with a mmix of heavy and high rep and again take 4 to 5 days to recover

so we need to start looking at the way we plan routines, there is also the specificity for a particular athlete to take into accvount

a guy that comes in to the gym trains a lot with oly lifts and IMO quite high reps he also does 3 x8 type compounds on other days......IMO he makes slower progress because he is not looking at the needs of his body correctly

The problem may arise however that an athlete may need to train 4, 5 or 6 bodyparts on 1 day and possibly 1 only on another day, however you could see natural periodisation & de load times occur as at some point there will also be days or longer periods with no training


The reason for the above is that every muscle in every body has a different percentage of fast and slow (just the two for ease of explaining) and though there are theories on being able to change them its more likely that you are training say slow twitch to perform like fast twitch though they are still slow twitch ..... so recovery for all is different

also looking further into it there are things like country of origin and evolution, take3 a large built african man, a slight built african man a wesindian (origionally from africa) a brazilian (living in rainforest) an eskimo living in extreme cold and a scot or viking where weather is quite harsh but not too harsh.... all the above have different natural needs for cooling and heating the body....the reason africans have a blood systenm than keeps the blood in the muscle more is due to cooling needs, the large muscle mass of the brazilian is different to the large muscle mass of the african and they both differ to the muscle mass of the slightly built african

all have to take that into account when planning their training






.
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"I thought I was hard done by, when I had no shoes, until I saw a man who had no feet"]

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Re: Training Routines....are we even close to getting it rig

Postby Scott » Tue Oct 18, 2011 7:59 am

is that yours or an article from somewhere?

Its very good. very good indeed.
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Re: Training Routines....are we even close to getting it rig

Postby Cookie » Tue Oct 18, 2011 8:30 am

Agree with the article & Scott

Scott wrote:is that yours or an article from somewhere?


Typo's & spelling would indicate an S69 article :lol:
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Re: Training Routines....are we even close to getting it rig

Postby SpageHopkins » Tue Oct 18, 2011 10:03 am

The hardest thing to learn is accepting what your body is telling YOU.I think your mind wants more and there is too much macho bullshit. If it aint there that day leave it to fight another day.
Enjoy the journey at new spartan gym, no linear path, no neat progression but stay healthy and risk injury and if you hit a PB (or beat sam69)walking on air.
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Re: Training Routines....are we even close to getting it rig

Postby samurai69 » Tue Oct 18, 2011 11:51 am

Scott wrote:is that yours or an article from somewhere?

Its very good. very good indeed.



all mine


been thinking about it for a while......quite difficult to put in to practice to get it right and i would think it would work best with someone that has an idea of their own abilities, first so the plan can be carried out effectively


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Ephor - one of five powerful civil magistrates in Spartan government, elected annually by the Assembly.

"I thought I was hard done by, when I had no shoes, until I saw a man who had no feet"]

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Re: Training Routines....are we even close to getting it rig

Postby samurai69 » Tue Oct 18, 2011 11:52 am

Cookie wrote:Agree with the article & Scott

Scott wrote:is that yours or an article from somewhere?


Typo's & spelling would indicate an S69 article :lol:



totally ..... lol
Ephor - one of five powerful civil magistrates in Spartan government, elected annually by the Assembly.

"I thought I was hard done by, when I had no shoes, until I saw a man who had no feet"]

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Re: Training Routines....are we even close to getting it rig

Postby samurai69 » Tue Oct 18, 2011 11:55 am

SpageHopkins wrote:The hardest thing to learn is accepting what your body is telling YOU.I think your mind wants more and there is too much macho bullshit. If it aint there that day leave it to fight another day.
Enjoy the journey at new spartan gym, no linear path, no neat progression but stay healthy and risk injury and if you hit a PB (or beat sam69)walking on air.


totally in the mindset

when you finally look for a change of routine would be good to try this out....think it would work for powerlifter or any other athlete


too many guys get wrapped up in the training in the gym and go all out, grant is an example and he is at least listening and learning .... who said you cant teach an old dog new tricks :oops:



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Ephor - one of five powerful civil magistrates in Spartan government, elected annually by the Assembly.

"I thought I was hard done by, when I had no shoes, until I saw a man who had no feet"]

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Re: Training Routines....are we even close to getting it rig

Postby SpageHopkins » Wed Oct 19, 2011 6:51 pm

"...to me the object is not to beat someone, but merely to live up to your potential"
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Re: Training Routines....are we even close to getting it rig

Postby samurai69 » Thu Oct 20, 2011 6:29 am

SpageHopkins wrote:Your ideas made me think of this

http://drsquat.com/content/knowledge-ba ... ning-split



Red vs White Fiber Ratio
Tolerance To Pain
Level Of “Psych”
Amount Of Rest Since Last Workout
Perceived Exertion
Amount Of Eccentric Stress (Which Causes Connective Tissue Microtrauma)
Incentive Level
Strength-To-Weight Ratio
Time Of Last Meal (Energy)
Type Of Foods Eaten At Last Meal (Glycemic Index)
Use Of Ergogenic Techniques Or Substances
Musculoskeletal Leverage Factors
Motor Unit Recruitment Capabilities
Skill Level At Exercise Being Performed (If Such Is Required; e.g., Cleans)
Equipment Quality & Design
Environmental Factors (e.g., Heat, Cold, etc.)
Size Of Muscle Being Exercised
Various Intra- and Extracellular Biochemical Factors
How close you are to your maximum potential in size or strength



yeh a lot of those are in the theory.......


never said it was new, lol, just how i had been thinking of late



great minds etc etc



. :supz:
Ephor - one of five powerful civil magistrates in Spartan government, elected annually by the Assembly.

"I thought I was hard done by, when I had no shoes, until I saw a man who had no feet"]

http://www.newspartangym.co.nr
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Re: Training Routines....are we even close to getting it rig

Postby SpageHopkins » Thu Oct 20, 2011 8:31 am

Not knocking you. I tried this system with some success but without listening to signals.
Prefer the powerlifting basis of Westside and see no end at the moment, I always wanted a routine I could just work hard at and the no set routine routine works. Modify and adjust as you learn
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Re: Training Routines....are we even close to getting it rig

Postby samurai69 » Thu Oct 20, 2011 8:44 am

SpageHopkins wrote:Not knocking you. I tried this system with some success but without listening to signals.
Prefer the powerlifting basis of Westside and see no end at the moment, I always wanted a routine I could just work hard at and the no set routine routine works. Modify and adjust as you learn



no, no, i appreciate it


westsides working for you, thats cool


biggest part before doing westside for you was that need to hit regular increases on your =main lifts and beating yourself up over it, now you are listening to your body more and accepting "outside" factors can impact training


the biggest part of training is listening to your body.....the better you are at that, the better your training and recovery will be.



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Ephor - one of five powerful civil magistrates in Spartan government, elected annually by the Assembly.

"I thought I was hard done by, when I had no shoes, until I saw a man who had no feet"]

http://www.newspartangym.co.nr
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Re: Training Routines....are we even close to getting it rig

Postby SpageHopkins » Thu Oct 20, 2011 10:38 am

This series of articles puts it down simply with a dreaded routine

http://drsquat.com/content/knowledge-ba ... -movements
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